Input please :)

[tsunamii]

I need your opinions on why I haven’t been seeing better results.

I’m 25 (almost), female, 5’8” and about 150 lbs. This is where I started about 6 weeks ago, with a goal to lose bodyfat and get in competition-shape (model).

I’ve been training with a trainer twice per week doing full body training. It’s almost like circuit training but with heavy weights for about 60 minutes each session focusing on legs, chest and back. I’ve been doing 3-4 days/week of cardio, with 0-1 HIIT sessions and 2-4 SS cardio sessions of about 30 minutes each (most weeks I just do 3 sessions).

I know these cals are low but I decided to put faith in my trainer and give it a shot for a few weeks. Here’s a typical day:

1- 1 cup cooked oatmeal w/6 egg whites
2- 1 C lowfat CC w/asparagus
3- 4 eggs hardboiled w/fibrous veggies
4- 3.5 oz fish w/asparagus
5- 4 eggs hardboiled w/fibrous veggies
6- ½ C lowfat CC mixed w/ 1/3 cup frozen berries
7- Plus 1-2 gallons of water

My totals have ranged between 1350-1550, fat 55-65, carbs 60-80, protein 130-180 for the past 4 weeks. I’m a vegetarian, so I can’t eat meat.

I have not lost any weight, but have lost almost three inches in my waist (30” to 27.25” - probably more like 28" today) and maybe an inch off the hips, almost an inch off the thighs and like a half inch off my arms.

My progress does not seem to match the effort I’ve put into this program, from planning to training to eating this brutal, boring diet. I’m at the point right now where I want to re-evaluate my goal of competing next month (no way I’m going to be ready)- I’m frustrated and upset and I feel confused now more than ever as to what to do to get results. I’m going to have a talk w/my trainer tonight about where to go from here, but I would like some thoughts from all of you as to why I have not progressed more rapidly. She’s really gung-ho about this diet and I’ve been skeptical about it from the start. She doesn’t understand why I’m not losing weight. Do you think my metabolism is f$cked or do you think I’m not working hard enough at the gym? I need some guidance/thoughts/etc. because I’m getting really confused and discouraged and am not sure where to go from here. Are my expectations just unrealistic? Help!

Thanks :)

[cm13cm]

im no expert but im wondering why your trainer is so fixated on you losing weight and not giving you props for losing inches. you've lost alot of inches for 6 weeks. don't get stuck on the number on the scale. that kept me from making any progress for years.

[strongchick]

Which are the meals around your workout?

Are you taking any EFAs?

I second that inches lost is definitely good. But I do think you aren't eating enough.

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by cm13cm@Jun 6 2006, 01:37 PM
im no expert but im wondering why your trainer is so fixated on you losing weight and not giving you props for losing inches. you've lost alot of inches for 6 weeks. don't get stuck on the number on the scale. that kept me from making any progress for years.
It bothers me too that she's so "weight-centric". She's like "you should have lost 10 pounds by now" and tells me about her other clients who follow the diet and how they're just DROPPING pounds. And then she asks me if I'm cheating- I hadn't had a cheat for a month before this past weekend!

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by strongchick@Jun 6 2006, 01:39 PM
Which are the meals around your workout?

Are you taking any EFAs?

I second that inches lost is definitely good. But I do think you aren't eating enough.
My workout is generally between meal 5 and 6 or between 4 and 5 if I'm only having 5 meals. Since carbs are a "no-no", I generally don't have a proper PWO meal. I'm stuck between listening to her and listening to the little voice in my head that thinks this diet is f :censor: cked.

[Erik]

I have not lost any weight, but have lost almost three inches in my waist (30” to 27.25” - probably more like 28" today) and maybe an inch off the hips, almost an inch off the thighs and like a half inch off my arms.

Stable weight with lost inches = simultaneous fat loss and muscle gain.

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by Thunder@Jun 6 2006, 01:52 PM


I have not lost any weight, but have lost almost three inches in my waist (30” to 27.25” - probably more like 28" today) and maybe an inch off the hips, almost an inch off the thighs and like a half inch off my arms.

Stable weight with lost inches = simultaneous fat loss and muscle gain.
:love: so do you think i'm just being impatient and freaking out? should i stick w/it until i see no progress? i just don't want to screw my metabolism and i'm having a hard time reconciling what she's telling me from what i've learned here.

[Erik]

You're undereating in my opinion, but if you're progressing you're progressing.

Make sure your expectations are at least realistic. I find this is the biggest problem people have - unrealisitic expectations.

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by Thunder@Jun 6 2006, 02:02 PM
You're undereating in my opinion, but if you're progressing you're progressing.

Make sure your expectations are at least realistic. I find this is the biggest problem people have - unrealisitic expectations.
Well, I'm probably going to try to compete in November instead of this summer- I think my expectations were realistic- to - a bit far-reaching, but my trainer seems to think I should be 15lbs lighter by now and it's really messing w/my head.

T- are you wait-listed? I'm thinking about switching over to you.

Thanks, I really appreciate your input.

[Erik]

Originally posted by tsunamii@Jun 6 2006, 03:09 PM
T- are you wait-listed? I'm thinking about switching over to you.

Thanks, I really appreciate your input.
Currently yes.

[Erik]

Originally posted by tsunamii+Jun 6 2006, 03:09 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (tsunamii @ Jun 6 2006, 03:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Thunder@Jun 6 2006, 02:02 PM
You&#39;re undereating in my opinion, but if you&#39;re progressing you&#39;re progressing.

Make sure your expectations are at least realistic. I find this is the biggest problem people have - unrealisitic expectations.
Well, I&#39;m probably going to try to compete in November instead of this summer- I think my expectations were realistic- to - a bit far-reaching, but my trainer seems to think I should be 15lbs lighter by now and it&#39;s really messing w/my head.

T- are you wait-listed? I&#39;m thinking about switching over to you.

Thanks, I really appreciate your input. [/b][/quote]
You&#39;ve made progress. Measurements don&#39;t lie. Your trainer is too fixated on the scale, which does what? Tells you what you weigh. It gives you no information on the composition of that weight, or whether you&#39;re gaining muscle and losing fat, which you appear to somehow be doing.

[cm13cm]

you said that she has told you that "other" people on the diet have been dropping pounds? that right there is a problem. same diet and macros will not work for everyone the same way

[Erik]

Originally posted by cm13cm@Jun 6 2006, 03:20 PM
you said that she has told you that "other" people on the diet have been dropping pounds? that right there is a problem. same diet and macros will not work for everyone the same way
I didn&#39;t even catch that part ...

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by cm13cm@Jun 6 2006, 02:20 PM
you said that she has told you that "other" people on the diet have been dropping pounds? that right there is a problem. same diet and macros will not work for everyone the same way
Ugh. I know. I really do know. But she entranced me with her wallet-full of before and after pics. AMAZING before and after pics. And I know it&#39;s best to only listen to one person at a time.

[Erik]

Originally posted by tsunamii@Jun 6 2006, 03:30 PM
Ugh. I know. I really do know. But she entranced me with her wallet-full of before and after pics. AMAZING before and after pics. And I know it&#39;s best to only listen to one person at a time.
Then she must know what she&#39;s doing. Or something.

You&#39;re getting results.

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by Thunder+Jun 6 2006, 02:16 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Thunder @ Jun 6 2006, 02:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by tsunamii@Jun 6 2006, 03:09 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-Thunder@Jun 6 2006, 02:02 PM
You&#39;re undereating in my opinion, but if you&#39;re progressing you&#39;re progressing.

Make sure your expectations are at least realistic. I find this is the biggest problem people have - unrealisitic expectations.
Well, I&#39;m probably going to try to compete in November instead of this summer- I think my expectations were realistic- to - a bit far-reaching, but my trainer seems to think I should be 15lbs lighter by now and it&#39;s really messing w/my head.

T- are you wait-listed? I&#39;m thinking about switching over to you.

Thanks, I really appreciate your input.
You&#39;ve made progress. Measurements don&#39;t lie. Your trainer is too fixated on the scale, which does what? Tells you what you weigh. It gives you no information on the composition of that weight, or whether you&#39;re gaining muscle and losing fat, which you appear to somehow be doing. [/b][/quote]
maybe it&#39;s that darned "newbie effect"


- would it be possible to secure a spot on your list? how long do you anticipate the wait to be? -

[Erik]

Shoot me a PM.

[brightblue2006]

I recently dropped my trainer for almost the exact scenario you describe. Her advice with regard to nutrition was questionable, and I felt that she was disappointed with me when the scale wasn&#39;t moving - even though I was losing inches. Although I&#39;m sure it wasn&#39;t her intention, she made me feel inadequate, and that I wasn&#39;t trying hard enough.

She actually told me to go see my doctor, as there must be something "wrong" with me. Hmm, she is still trying to figure out why I didn&#39;t renew my sessions with her...

With regard to your typical day, that looks like a lot of eggs&#33; Am I reading this right - you are eating 8 whole eggs plus 6 egg whites per day... wow. What about substituting with some protein powder?

[Pinky]

IMO, some change is better then no change.

I too, am a scale watcher, even though I know it is useless. My weight has been hovering the same for the past 2 months and I am not noticing and inches lost, so I know I need to change something.

Good Luck&#33;

[fitmommy]

I see your eating fish?? I thought you were a vegetarian? Vegetarians do not eat fish.

If your not a veg, I would eat more fish and less eggs, just for the taste factor. :p

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by brightblue2006@Jun 6 2006, 02:37 PM
I recently dropped my trainer for almost the exact scenario you describe. Her advice with regard to nutrition was questionable, and I felt that she was disappointed with me when the scale wasn&#39;t moving - even though I was losing inches. Although I&#39;m sure it wasn&#39;t her intention, she made me feel inadequate, and that I wasn&#39;t trying hard enough.

She actually told me to go see my doctor, as there must be something "wrong" with me. Hmm, she is still trying to figure out why I didn&#39;t renew my sessions with her...

With regard to your typical day, that looks like a lot of eggs&#33; Am I reading this right - you are eating 8 whole eggs plus 6 egg whites per day... wow. What about substituting with some protein powder?
Sorry that happened to you- it&#39;s so hard to find a good trainer. I&#39;m conflicted because she&#39;s really a great person and goes above and beyond for me- as far as exercise she&#39;s great, but the nutrition part sucks.

I know I do eat a lot of eggs. It sucks not eating meat on such a high protein diet, and I go through phases where fish completely grosses me out. I was actually just thinking about incorporating a protein supp into my diet- I think it&#39;s a great idea and may help me cut down the sat fat.

[strongchick]

Is she certified in nutrition? What is her background there?

It concerns me that she has you have no carbs post workout. Although it is true that you are progressing...but I wonder how long that will last.

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by fitmommy@Jun 6 2006, 02:40 PM
I see your eating fish?? I thought you were a vegetarian? Vegetarians do not eat fish.

If your not a veg, I would eat more fish and less eggs, just for the taste factor. :p
ok, i&#39;m a pescatarian. it takes to long to explain to people who aren&#39;t familiar. i eat fish and eggs and some dairy.

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by strongchick@Jun 6 2006, 02:45 PM
Is she certified in nutrition? What is her background there?

It concerns me that she has you have no carbs post workout. Although it is true that you are progressing...but I wonder how long that will last.
No, just personal training cert- she&#39;s got 23 years of experience there and good references.

I don&#39;t know how much longer the progress will last, either- i feel like i&#39;m not moving very fast anyway. I feel like my body might want to let go of more bodyfat if my calories were a bit higher, but i don&#39;t know that for sure. I do know that no carbs = sad sad existence.

[strongchick]

Experience doesn&#39;t always mean good knowledge.

Have you talked to her about this?

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by strongchick@Jun 6 2006, 02:53 PM
Experience doesn&#39;t always mean good knowledge.

Have you talked to her about this?
I&#39;ve talked to her about it in the sense that she chides me for not losing weight and I tell her I&#39;m losing inches and that weight isn&#39;t everything. Or she tells me I can&#39;t have carbs other than in the morning because your body doesn&#39;t know the difference between oatmeal and chocolate cake and I come back with "ummm, yeah it does- one&#39;s a complex, starchy carb with almost no fat and the other is fat/simple sugars. She tells me that I&#39;ve got to listen to her and eat like this because my body is used to all that "junk" I used to eat and once I eat her way, the fat will melt right off. I try to explain to her that I&#39;ve been eating clean for several weeks before I started with her and that my body is in no way used to "junk", so she can&#39;t compare me to Joe Couchpotato over there losing 10lbs in a week.

Talking to her is hard because she thinks she knows more than me (I don&#39;t want to assume anything either way, but that&#39;s what she thinks) and she&#39;s got kind of a forceful personality while still being caring. I don&#39;t know how to approach it anymore. We&#39;re talking tonight, though, so we&#39;ll see.

[Ashes41]

Originally posted by tsunamii+Jun 6 2006, 03:06 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (tsunamii @ Jun 6 2006, 03:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-strongchick@Jun 6 2006, 02:53 PM
Experience doesn&#39;t always mean good knowledge.

Have you talked to her about this?
I&#39;ve talked to her about it in the sense that she chides me for not losing weight and I tell her I&#39;m losing inches and that weight isn&#39;t everything. Or she tells me I can&#39;t have carbs other than in the morning because your body doesn&#39;t know the difference between oatmeal and chocolate cake and I come back with "ummm, yeah it does- one&#39;s a complex, starchy carb with almost no fat and the other is fat/simple sugars. She tells me that I&#39;ve got to listen to her and eat like this because my body is used to all that "junk" I used to eat and once I eat her way, the fat will melt right off. I try to explain to her that I&#39;ve been eating clean for several weeks before I started with her and that my body is in no way used to "junk", so she can&#39;t compare me to Joe Couchpotato over there losing 10lbs in a week.

Talking to her is hard because she thinks she knows more than me (I don&#39;t want to assume anything either way, but that&#39;s what she thinks) and she&#39;s got kind of a forceful personality while still being caring. I don&#39;t know how to approach it anymore. We&#39;re talking tonight, though, so we&#39;ll see. [/b][/quote]
My personal opinion, any time you HIRE someone, they should always be willing to listen to you... doesn&#39;t mean what you say should always be right, but it doesn&#39;t seem to me like she is listening to you at all...


And her knowledge base leaves something to be desired, IMO.

[strongchick]

umm...her explanations show she doesn&#39;t know what she&#39;s talking about.

And the fact that she isn&#39;t really listening to you is also a concern. That alone would make me stop working with her.

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by Ashes41@Jun 6 2006, 03:13 PM


My personal opinion, any time you HIRE someone, they should always be willing to listen to you... doesn&#39;t mean what you say should always be right, but it doesn&#39;t seem to me like she is listening to you at all...


And her knowledge base leaves something to be desired, IMO.
I know you&#39;re right. I just feel like I&#39;m in a difficult situation now. Believe it or not, it&#39;s difficult to find a serious trainer in LA who trains female competitors and doesn&#39;t cost a freaking fortune. Perhaps she&#39;s still not the best option for me.

[Erik]

I&#39;d like to see an example of the training program ...

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by Thunder@Jun 6 2006, 03:28 PM
I&#39;d like to see an example of the training program ...
It&#39;s difficult to accurately describe because she does a different workout every time. Generally it goes something like this:

3 sets of between 6 and 8 exercises

2 exercises are superset at a time

for example, she&#39;ll start me off on the leg press- 180lbs X 15-20 and superset that with walking lunges carrying two 15 lb dumbells

then we&#39;ll move on and superset bench pressing (oly bar only) or chest presses (20 lb dumbell each) with shoulder presses (10 lb dumbell) 15 reps of each

then we&#39;ll go do deadlifts and squats with 27lb dumbells (15-20 reps)- superset with reverse curls (20 reps)

That&#39;s just an example. Sometimes in between these supersets, she&#39;ll have me do 3 minutes of intense cardio There is no rest incorporated into this workout, so I&#39;ll often tell her when I need to rest and just do it.

:: getting ready for the backlash :: :shutit: ;)

[Erik]

A different workout every single time? Then how do you measure performance progress? What&#39;s the training split? Why such high reps?

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by Thunder@Jun 6 2006, 04:00 PM
A different workout every single time? Then how do you measure performance progress? What&#39;s the training split? Why such high reps?
There is no discernable pattern or structure. She just goes from memory as far as my strength progress goes - it bothers me that she doesn&#39;t write it down like other trainers I&#39;ve worked with.

The high reps blow. I don&#39;t know the thinking behind it. Sometimes she&#39;ll have days where she lowers the reps to 8 and goes heavier, but mostly the reps are high.

My muscles are developing nicely under there, but I wonder if I&#39;m not spinning my wheels to a large degree here.

[strongchick]

Doesn&#39;t sound very good to me....how can you progress if you keep doing something different? And if you aren&#39;t keeping track of the weights, how can you know you are lifting heavier each time?

I&#39;d think you&#39;re spinning dem.

[jrb1980]

OMG This was my exact senerio - all of it - the workout, the trainer wanting faster results, the diet.....so...i fired her. :lol:

The guy I have now is pretty good :cool: Anyway, my weight is stable too, and I am still getting leaner and losing inches (though it is slow). I have had to re-evaluate goals and such which is actually liberating for me. I am now taking it one day at a time, setting goals within my control - like follow my program - not Lose 10 pounds&#33;

[Erik]

Originally posted by jrb1980@Jun 6 2006, 05:33 PM
OMG This was my exact senerio - all of it - the workout, the trainer wanting faster results, the diet.....so...i fired her. :lol:

I actually thought of you when I read this thread. :lol:

[PowerManDL]

You know, with the fact that there are so many horrible trainers out there that still get paid lots of money, it makes me wonder why the fuck I&#39;m not doing it for a living.

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by jrb1980@Jun 6 2006, 04:33 PM
OMG This was my exact senerio - all of it - the workout, the trainer wanting faster results, the diet.....so...i fired her. :lol:

The guy I have now is pretty good :cool: Anyway, my weight is stable too, and I am still getting leaner and losing inches (though it is slow). I have had to re-evaluate goals and such which is actually liberating for me. I am now taking it one day at a time, setting goals within my control - like follow my program - not Lose 10 pounds&#33;
So it&#39;s looking like I might have to do the same thing. Ugh. Tonight&#39;s gonna be awkward. And I paid her &#036;400 upfront for 8 sessions... I think I&#39;ve only used one of them.

Thanks to you all- you&#39;ve really helped clarify my situation. Ugh, hopefully I can figure out where to go from here.

jrb- do you compete or workout for health/looks/weighloss/whatever?

[tsunamii]

Originally posted by PowerManDL@Jun 6 2006, 04:41 PM
You know, with the fact that there are so many horrible trainers out there that still get paid lots of money, it makes me wonder why the fuck I&#39;m not doing it for a living.
word.