View Full Version : What to do to increase squat
funnyesq
12-06-2006, 02:28 PM
I've seen a lot of goals to squat more and more weight and I find it challenging that so many of you are squatting well in excess of 100 lbs.
I think the easiest answer to my above question is to "squat more." But I'm looking for some more specifics that are not quite so obvious to me.
I can leg press about 300 for a good 10-12 reps. I have taken it easy over the past month or so with foot issues and illness etc...so I think it will take me another few weeks to get back to that level. I also do a hack squat machine that is more standing and dipping with butt (I call it a butt machine...it has a curved foot plate and my feet are placed at the top of the curve ...gets your butt more that way)...and that is at about 220 lbs. I do walking lunges up and down hallways (no added weight yet but getting close) and some other squat type moves involving plyometrics. I'd say my legs are getting stronger and I only somewhat recently started BB squating (with the time off as referenced above because of foot issues and illness and biz trips). I left off at about 50 lbs...it's possible I can do much more already but I really don't know until I try. I will try to squat more but given the above (if it is helpful) "should" I be squatting more, do I need to do more/different leg work to help increase my squat load? Thanks.
If you want to squat more (weight) then squat more frequently. I don't think that lunges and hack squats and leg presses will necessarily help you squat more weight. Much like pullups and every other exercise...you want to get better at it, then you need to do that exercise. Of course...a well-rounded, well-designed program is needed also, in terms of gaining overall strength and avoiding over-training.
Robben
12-06-2006, 02:47 PM
Don't forget to supplement with Amino's... Amino's are a must!
Don't forget to supplement with Amino's... Amino's are a must!
Why's that? Why would she have to supplement with aminos to get a bigger squat? What's wrong with protein?
http://www.geocities.com/elitemadcow1/table_of_contents_thread.htm
Consider something along the lines of the intermediate version.
Cindy Day
12-06-2006, 03:26 PM
http://www.geocities.com/elitemadcow1/table_of_contents_thread.htm
Consider something along the lines of the intermediate version.
Excellent looking site Tony. :thumb:
jaleena
12-06-2006, 03:39 PM
Be patient. Progress isn't always linear.
tryinhard
12-06-2006, 03:57 PM
Yes be patient. There are more muscles involved than just legs. I always have to tell myself to be patient because like you I want to see great gains in my squat but I do not want to injure myself.
Iron Will
12-06-2006, 04:01 PM
Why's that? Why would she have to supplement with aminos to get a bigger squat? What's wrong with protein?
protein is for the littles, testosterone is where its at :pimpslap:
(Thanks for the tip thunder ;))
Marcelo
12-06-2006, 04:51 PM
Just squat.
PerfectAnjail
12-06-2006, 04:53 PM
Ok. So I have a question here. I know that certain exercises are quad or ham dominant. But unless you're doing leg extensions or curls, some part of the entire leg is called into play, no? So if she can leg press 300lbs, why wouldn't she be able to at least perform lunges with added weight? And why would her squat be so weak (relatively)? What am I missing?
And to answer your question, if you want to up your squat, squat more (often).
Ok. So I have a question here. I know that certain exercises are quad or ham dominant. But unless you're doing leg extensions or curls, some part of the entire leg is called into play, no?
Correct
So if she can leg press 300lbs, why wouldn't she be able to at least perform lunges with added weight? And why would her squat be so weak (relatively)? What am I missing?
No idea. Doesn't make sense at all. Machine weight used doesn't necessarily carry over to big compound movements. They're different.
It's like some guy saying he can do leg extensions with 250lbs ... yet can't full squat 185 lbs.
And to answer your question, if you want to up your squat, squat more (often).
This point is true. It's like any skill development. Take a golf swing. It's motor learning. Want a better golf swing? Practice it more often ... assuming correct technique is already in place.
However, at the same time one could look to see where in the squat they're weak and start focusing on other movements to strengthen that weakness. However, in this case, with the weights being used, it doesn't seem like that's worth doing.
Eat more. People don't make great strength gains while dieting more often than not.
Marcelo
12-06-2006, 05:25 PM
This point is true. It's like any skill development. Take a golf swing. It's motor learning. Want a better golf swing? Practice it more often ... assuming correct technique is already in place.
Eat more. People don't make great strength gains while dieting more often than not.
Agreed. There is no real insider tip to be given. Eat more and squat more ;)
Jared
12-06-2006, 05:26 PM
http://secure.mycart.net/product_images/catalog213/leviathan1.jpg
:lol3:
Marcelo
12-06-2006, 05:27 PM
http://secure.mycart.net/product_images/catalog213/leviathan1.jpg
:lol3:
:thumb:
Sportsgirl
12-06-2006, 05:45 PM
As people have already mentioned, if you want to squat more - well, squat MORE. The routine (5x5 - see the sticky above) I'm currently doing has me squatting 3x a week and I can now not only squat more than I used to but with better form.
Robben
12-06-2006, 09:15 PM
Why's that? Why would she have to supplement with aminos to get a bigger squat? What's wrong with protein?
Thunder, there is nothing wrong with protein; never said there was... In fact, I eat between 240 and 300 grams of it a day. But, I also supplement with Aminos. The use of high levels of protein are not enough in and of itself.
The benefits from amino acids supplementation in a short form answer is this:
Amino's will help the body increase protein synthesis, increase the energy levels, assist the body in tissue repair. And lastly amino's will help in the retention of nitrogen - gotta have a positive nitrogen balance.
Iron Will
12-06-2006, 09:16 PM
Thunder, there is nothing wrong with protein; never said there was... In fact, I eat between 240 and 300 grams of it a day. But, I also supplement with Aminos. The use of high levels of protein are not enough in and of itself.
The benefits from amino acids supplementation in short answer is this:
Amino's will help the body increase protein synthesis, increase the energy levels, assist the body in tissue repair. And lastly amino's will help in the retention of nitrogen - gotta have a positive nitrogen balance.
I'm a big amino fan, i got your back :thumb:
jaleena
12-06-2006, 09:18 PM
I'm a big amino fan, i got your back :thumb:
But you also use the sissy pad, so your opinion is suspect :p
Iron Will
12-06-2006, 09:20 PM
But you also use the sissy pad, so your opinion is suspect :p
HAHA haven't heard that one before!!!! HAHA did you make that up yourself HAHA that was clever! HAHA you should do stand up HAHA I mean seriously that was totally original... :thumb: wow you are a smart cookie. :lol:
Miker
12-07-2006, 12:04 AM
at the cost of starting a debate on the merits of Alwyn Cosgrove..
he addressed a question similar to the one above.
Cosgrove: The trainee needs to look past the obvious solution to any problem and look for the real solution. For example, every arm training article in the last ten years to improve your arm circumference has included a workout based on curls and triceps extensions. Do you really think a lack of doing curls is the reason why most guys have less than impressive arms?
Every article on how to improve your chin-ups includes a program with a shitload of chin-ups in it. Is that all you've got? Improve your chin-ups by just doing more of them?
Really fucking cutting edge that is!
In the arm example, it's often the ability of the upper back to stabilize a load out in front of you (i.e. the midpoint of a curl). If the back can't stabilize that load, it's not going to risk a spine injury to curl the weight up — it just "shuts down" your biceps. You just need "tae use yir heid!" as my dad used to say in a heavy Scottish accent.
would the same idea not hold true for squats? Having said that, I agree that more practice at the movement makes it easier.... I also see some sense in Alwyn's rather rough statement.
char-dawg
12-07-2006, 12:21 AM
With women, especially beginners, the limiting factor is not leg strength but core/back strength. They think, "I can leg press X amount, why can't I squat the same?" Well, one, a lot of leg presses are on a slide, which right there, unless you're pressing vertically, is going to mean that you can use more weight just because you're not lifting as directly against gravity, and two, your back is supported in a leg press. (Plus of course in a squat your legs are ALSO lifting everything in your body above them, plus the weight on the bar.)
To give an analogy, Stel has some great calves. If we get on a seated calf raise or one of those donkey machines where your bend over and the pad is on your lower back, she can do as much weight as I can. Maybe more. But put us on a standing calf raise, where the weight is supported on your shoulders, and I'll kill her. It's not that her calves are weaker than mine, it's that her torso stability/strength isn't there.
Of course, all this doesn't mean that you shouldn't squat more. You should. But if you're wondering why...
John Sullivan
12-07-2006, 12:27 AM
There are so many reasons why your squat can suck. A few key ones:
1) A weak muscle or muscle group somewhere between your feet and neck. May not even be your legs
2) Your form might suck (in this case squatting more often will make things suck more)
3) Poor programming (sets, reps, recovery, etc)
Having someone who knows what they are doing watch you squat can be very helpful.
would the same idea not hold true for squats? Having said that, I agree that more practice at the movement makes it easier.... I also see some sense in Alwyn's rather rough statement.
And as I said, other movements can be used to increase the squat as well. Simply look at where you're weak in the squat and use exercises that really focus on bringing up those weak points.
PerfectAnjail
12-07-2006, 01:07 AM
With women, especially beginners, the limiting factor is not leg strength but core/back strength. They think, "I can leg press X amount, why can't I squat the same?" Well, one, a lot of leg presses are on a slide, which right there, unless you're pressing vertically, is going to mean that you can use more weight just because you're not lifting as directly against gravity, and two, your back is supported in a leg press. (Plus of course in a squat your legs are ALSO lifting everything in your body above them, plus the weight on the bar.)
To give an analogy, Stel has some great calves. If we get on a seated calf raise or one of those donkey machines where your bend over and the pad is on your lower back, she can do as much weight as I can. Maybe more. But put us on a standing calf raise, where the weight is supported on your shoulders, and I'll kill her. It's not that her calves are weaker than mine, it's that her torso stability/strength isn't there.
Of course, all this doesn't mean that you shouldn't squat more. You should. But if you're wondering why...
This is definitely my problem right now. I just forgot to put it. My core strength, after having a little one, by csection, is most def not what it should be and is severely limiting my squat numbers. But in due time, in due time. I've just added some core strengthening exercises to the full body im doing at the moment.
Inatic
12-07-2006, 01:34 AM
I found wave loading helped me add more wt to my squat.
funnyesq
12-07-2006, 03:59 AM
Thanks for the advise.
1. I can see that trying to improve while on a calorie deficit will be hard.
2. I have no clue where I get my leg strength. Whether horizontal or vertical, I can leg press about 300+. With the hack squat with the curved plate it's about 200+ (targeting my glutes more than the quads). I think Thunder or ? has a good point that I didn't consider about machine weight vs. free weight. Obviously squats are free weight and it is more difficult to lift free, than with a machine...at least I've found this to be the case.
3. I can also see that repetition helps to develop this "skill." So I guess I need to DO them more.
4. I think my form is okay. I could probably work on getting a bit lower. At the moment, I'm just below parallel. I also have to watch that the knees don't go forward of my toes.
5. I can also see the need to improve the back, and shoulder and since I've had some neck/shoulder issues which are only now showing improvement, that may have held me back a bit too. My core is getting stronger and it makes sense that this will help all sorts of exercises.
Well I have a goal. Squat more, and with more weight. Maybe I can get to 100 lbs by the end of 2007.
4. I think my form is okay. I could probably work on getting a bit lower. At the moment, I'm just below parallel. I also have to watch that the knees don't go forward of my toes.
Oh yeah? Why's that?
Why don't you stand up right now and squat deep ... and keep the knees behind your toes. Let me know how fast you fall on your ass.
funnyesq
12-07-2006, 04:17 AM
Oh yeah? Why's that?
Why don't you stand up right now and squat deep ... and keep the knees behind your toes. Let me know how fast you fall on your ass.
'tis true and that's what worries me about squating...I can't seem to balance and stay somewhat back...but what I read is that you should try to have the shins vertical....Is it that I should do whatever to get below parallel and if the knees are in front of the toes...oh well?
Audrey
12-07-2006, 04:47 AM
'tis true and that's what worries me about squating...I can't seem to balance and stay somewhat back...but what I read is that you should try to have the shins vertical....Is it that I should do whatever to get below parallel and if the knees are in front of the toes...oh well?
1. Start full squatting
2. Stop worrying about the toes not passing the knees thing. It is one of the biggest myths floating around and is absolute non-sense. Try doing a full squat keeping your back straight and your toes behind your knees... impossible ;)
Strive2Define
12-07-2006, 04:51 AM
Honestly i think what held me back the most in the beginning was the mental aspect.Once I got past the point of worrying about whether or not the weight was too heavy, everything else fell into place.Also make sure you are keeping your elbows pointed to the floor..if they are flaring up and back it does have a tendency to pitch you forward in the bottom.Keep chest up and shoulders pulled back.Just do it...
PerfectAnjail
12-07-2006, 02:28 PM
'tis true and that's what worries me about squating...I can't seem to balance and stay somewhat back...but what I read is that you should try to have the shins vertical....Is it that I should do whatever to get below parallel and if the knees are in front of the toes...oh well?
Go check Sportsgirl's journal. Page...110ish I think. Are you saying that her form is not perfect? :scratch: :finger: Forget the straight shins and...knees in front of your toes. If you try to do that, and a full squat, you will fall directly on your ass.
'tis true and that's what worries me about squating...I can't seem to balance and stay somewhat back...but what I read is that you should try to have the shins vertical....Is it that I should do whatever to get below parallel and if the knees are in front of the toes...oh well?
That's impossible.
My point was basically, who cares? You can't squat unless your toes go past your knees and them doing such isn't something to worry about.
The knees SHOULDN'T go past the toes. To ensure that, I squat in these:
http://www.rakemag.com/today/yoivanhoe/archive/clown%20shoes%204.jpg
Miker
12-07-2006, 02:55 PM
The knees SHOULDN'T go past the toes. To ensure that, I squat in these:
http://www.rakemag.com/today/yoivanhoe/archive/clown%20shoes%204.jpg
LOL.. there goes that mouthful of water...
Sportsgirl
12-07-2006, 03:07 PM
I have concluded that computers are not safe from water spillage on this forum
Christina
12-08-2006, 12:23 PM
The knees SHOULDN'T go past the toes. To ensure that, I squat in these:
http://www.rakemag.com/today/yoivanhoe/archive/clown%20shoes%204.jpg
Are those your feet Tony? Cause, you know what they say......
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