PDA

View Full Version : Sodium



Leah
05-19-2006, 12:46 PM
Originally posted by Thunder


My thoughts on sodium ...


Keep in mind, I am speaking to the population that is involved in healthy eating, fitness as a lifestyle, etc. Not so much the average North American who is overweight, eats fast food all the time, etc. And much of this is very specific to the competitor.

Ok, let's see, water retention. This is probably the most common one.

Everyone equates sodium with water retention. This is true, but most people have misunderstood this process, or simply don't know enough about it. Sodium and potassium are two of the most delicately controlled minerals in our bodies. We can only voluntarily upset this tightly regulated balance for a short period of time before our bodies adapt to our dietary intake, and adjust certain hormones to compensate and return intra and extracellular quantities to the desired amounts.

What causes water retention is CHANGES in sodium intake. So when one goes from low to high - until their body can adapt, they'll hold water. When one goes from high to low - until their body can adapt, they'll lose water. HOWEVER, if one were to stay high, once the body adapted it would adjust retained levels and excrete the rest. You could effectively make this higher than normal intake be your new baseline - ie. no water retention.

Fluid balance is governed by the kidneys and the various hormones - antidiuretic hormone, aldosterone etc. When aldosterone levels are high, your body promotes the reuptake of sodium and water in the kidneys - basically you hold water. When aldosterone levels are low, your body flushes water and sodium through the kidneys. As a result, sodium balance remains normal. This is the case with all apparently healthy individuals who do not already have a blood pressure condition.

So what affects aldosterone?

High water and high salt = low aldosterone (water excreting processes)
Low water and low salt = high aldosterone (water retaining processes)

So when sodium is up for a prolonged period of time, and you're drinking lots of water, you will suppress aldosterone levels, which will cause you to flush the excess sodium and water. Sodium and water are also like magnets to each other, so when one leaves, so does the other. So you could effectively train your body to treat a higher sodium intake as 'normal'.So While, yes, increased sodium intake will cause some initial water retention, the retention is only temporary.

When sodium is low for a prolonged period of time, regardless of water consumption (because aldosterone responds to both water and sodium (and potassium actually), you will suppress aldosterone. Your body senses this as a stress and since it needs to maintain sodium for cellular processes, it promotes reuptake of it in the kidneys. You keep what little is coming in. And remember, where sodium goes, water goes.

A lot of people trying to lose weight cut their sodium down. I am not sure why, as sodium and water have nothing to do with fat loss.

The benefits of keeping salt in the diet, besides what is mentioned above is that one, food tastes better (LOL) and two it causes an increase in blood volume which improves both oxygen and nutrient delivery to, and waste removal (CO2, lactic acid, etc) from, your working muscles. Additionally increased blood volume will result in better gym performance.

The only circumstance in which individuals may benefit by monitoring their sodium intake is if they have already been clinically diagnosed as suffering from hypertension and are also salt sensitive Keep in mind, only about 20% of the population is salt sensitive.

Oh, and scrap the table salt. Use kosher salt or unrefined sea salt – higher mineral content.

Oh, and sodium is also responsible for delivering potassium inside the cell (Na pump). If there isn't enough sodium, you're body is forced to use an active transport mechanism to get the job done. This is not the preferred means of operation for your body. What ends up happening is that less potassium is transported due to energy costs.

Espi
05-19-2006, 01:03 PM
Isn't it better to concentrate on upping potassium intake. AFAIK our sodium intake is more than adequate, compared to what the 'Neanderthaler' (wo)man was eating, while potassium intake is much lower in comparison.

hemi
05-19-2006, 01:41 PM
Very interesting. Thank you, good timing for me to read that!

Lynny
05-19-2006, 02:22 PM
I've read this article many times. Great info...but something just occured to me. How can one figure out what a normal amount of salt intake is? I just really have no idea! I tend to put lots of salt on things....but I also drink tons of water, and really don't experience water retension from this. How do you know what is a "high sodium" diet?

mipinky
05-19-2006, 03:42 PM
That was very interesting and I just learned something I did not know. Thanks Thunder!! :shades: Can we make it a stickie?

siamese twin
05-19-2006, 06:33 PM
I am so happy I can still have my salt!

3sweeties
05-19-2006, 07:33 PM
I love salt. :)

Erik
05-19-2006, 07:34 PM
Originally posted by 3sweeties@May 19 2006, 03:33 PM
I love salt. :)
I love pizza.

Jen
05-19-2006, 07:39 PM
I have to comment.

2 years ago Erik (Thunder) told me to increase my sodium and I remember the long scientific debates about higher sodium levels and training.

I was reluctant to listen but did- I did hold much more subcutaneous water for about a week. the homeostasis kicked in.
I was doing Westside training at that point(ie strength focus, alot of OLY lifts).
My strength seemed to stick with me longer in training & I got killer pumps.

here I am this year preparing for figure comp. I somehow had dug myself into the low sodium pit again.
I was advised once again, to get sodium high. Hesitant, especially preparing for figure, to listen.
I did.
Holding a bit of water.. but this has made ALL the difference in training performance, pumps, etc.
Once I cut it the final week I rest assured this water will come off.


Awesome post Leah. :cool: much for some to learn! Im glad I did!

Erik
05-19-2006, 07:40 PM
When are you reducing it?

Jen
05-19-2006, 07:41 PM
Originally posted by Thunder@May 19 2006, 07:40 PM
When are you reducing it?
I think we cut 2-3 days out? slowly reduce though.... so that ADH doesnt kick in and make be soft looking from cutting too soon.

Erik
05-19-2006, 07:46 PM
Originally posted by atherjen@May 19 2006, 03:41 PM
I think we cut 2-3 days out? slowly reduce though.... so that ADH doesnt kick in and make be soft looking from cutting too soon.
I don't want to step on anyone's toes so I'm going to not comment. ;)

Are you using diuretics?

Jen
05-19-2006, 07:49 PM
Originally posted by Thunder@May 19 2006, 07:46 PM
I don't want to step on anyone's toes so I'm going to not comment. ;)

Are you using diuretics?
:baby:




no diuretics

Erik
05-19-2006, 07:51 PM
Originally posted by atherjen+May 19 2006, 03:49 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (atherjen @ May 19 2006, 03:49 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Thunder@May 19 2006, 07:46 PM
I don&#39;t want to step on anyone&#39;s toes so I&#39;m going to not comment. ;)

Are you using diuretics?
:baby:




no diuretics [/b][/quote]
:lol:

I&#39;ll post the reply here ...

(actually I don&#39;t have it in my sent box)

Lynny
05-19-2006, 10:34 PM
Originally posted by Lynny@May 19 2006, 08:22 AM
I&#39;ve read this article many times. Great info...but something just occured to me. How can one figure out what a normal amount of salt intake is? I just really have no idea&#33; I tend to put lots of salt on things....but I also drink tons of water, and really don&#39;t experience water retension from this. How do you know what is a "high sodium" diet?
does anyone know the answer to this by chance??? :p

Leah
05-19-2006, 11:05 PM
well...the rda is 2400 mg or something like that but basically...if you&#39;re healthy and eating reasonably clean...meaning not eating out of a can or frozen dinners, etc....then you don&#39;t really have anything to worry about. Just keep doing what you do :)

Lynny
05-20-2006, 05:41 AM
Originally posted by Leah@May 19 2006, 05:05 PM
well...the rda is 2400 mg or something like that but basically...if you&#39;re healthy and eating reasonably clean...meaning not eating out of a can or frozen dinners, etc....then you don&#39;t really have anything to worry about. Just keep doing what you do :)
alright, thanks ;)

trueblue
05-21-2006, 11:11 AM
well that certainly explains alot. i did wonder, when I first read my plan if I misunderstood when i was told to salt food liberally, spesh when I was so used to hearing... cut salt out...

thanks... really really helpful... and I learnt something today.

mipinky
05-22-2006, 07:22 PM
I :love: Salt but never have it

jrb1980
10-30-2006, 03:43 AM
Can we make this a sticky? I like it.