Thoughts on Gary Taubes' "Good Calories, Bad Calories"

[GraceGirl]

Has anyone read this book? Taubes wrote a New York Times article a few years ago supporting low carb diets. He declares (with a myriad of scientific research) that carbs is what causes obesity and heart disease, and not fat, saturated or otherwise. He claims that the amount of calories you ingest each day does not matter, as long as they're not carbs. So does that mean I can eat ten bricks of cheese a day and NOT get fat? Sweet!!!!

Here are the "11 critical conclusions" of the book:

1. Dietary fat, whether saturated or not, does not cause heart disease.

2. Carbohydrates do, because of their effect on the hormone insulin. The more easily-digestible and refined the carbohydrates and the more fructose they contain, the greater the effect on our health, weight, and well-being.

3. Sugars--sucrose (table sugar) and high fructose corn syrup specifically--are particularly harmful. The glucose in these sugars raises insulin levels; the fructose they contain overloads the liver.

4. Refined carbohydrates, starches, and sugars are also the most likely dietary causes of cancer, Alzheimer's Disease, and the other common chronic diseases of modern times.

5. Obesity is a disorder of excess fat accumulation, not overeating and not sedentary behavior.

6. Consuming excess calories does not cause us to grow fatter any more than it causes a child to grow taller.

7. Exercise does not make us lose excess fat; it makes us hungry.

8. We get fat because of an imbalance--a disequilibrium--in the hormonal regulation of fat tissue and fat metabolism. More fat is stored in the fat tissue than is mobilized and used for fuel. We become leaner when the hormonal regulation of the fat tissue reverses this imbalance.

9. Insulin is the primary regulator of fat storage. When insulin levels are elevated, we stockpile calories as fat. When insulin levels fall, we release fat from our fat tissue and burn it for fuel.

10. By stimulating insulin secretion, carbohydrates make us fat and ultimately cause obesity. By driving fat accumulation, carbohydrates also increase hunger and decrease the amount of energy we expend in metabolism and physical activity.

11. The fewer carbohydrates we eat, the leaner we will be.

Thoughts please. :D

[Pandora]

About #11:

About 50-60% of my diet comes from carbs and I'm leaner than I've even been.. and I'm diabetic. Maybe I'm an anomaly.

[Patricia]

#7 is very true...:lol:..well, I'm hungry regardless...

[GraceGirl]

Taubes claims that the big push for Americans to exercise is actually making us fatter. He says we exercise because we've been told to, but then we get so hungry because of the workout, that we end up consuming a bunch of the wrong foods.

First of all, I believe he's generalizing too much. Not all Americans workout and then stuff their face with a bunch of junk. I know with me, exercising, while YES, it does make me hungry, compells me to eat the RIGHT kinds of food. It actually helps me to adhere to my diet rather than blow it.

Second of all, if people are working out and then stuffing their face with processed crap, then they either a) believe that as long as you workout, you can eat whatever you want; b) are using exercise as an excuse to eat whatever they want; or c) they simply don't know how to implement a plan.

My other beef with his data is saying that the number of calories you consume doesn't matter. How can he say it's fine to eat as much fat as you want, because it's the carbs, not the calories, that make people fat? Because good Lord, if that's the case, then unwrap the case of gouda, and let's get chowing!!!!

[GraceGirl]

So apparently, Gary Taubes was on Larry King Live last night talking about his controversial book. I came across the transcript and thought I'd post the link:

CNN.com - Transcripts (http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0710/19/lkl.01.html)

[Erik]

I still have to reply to this ...

I've been lazy.

[Cris]

I still have to reply to this ...

I've been lazy.

Get to replying already....inquiring minds want to know!!! :lol3:

[GraceGirl]

I still have to reply to this ...

I've been lazy.

You slob.

[synergyb3]

I'm curious about this book, too.

Thanks for the link, GraceGirl. I want to read that.

[Shellie]

:popcorn:

[jackieleigh]

About #11:

About 50-60% of my diet comes from carbs and I'm leaner than I've even been.. and I'm diabetic. Maybe I'm an anomaly.


You and me both....

For me it is all about calories, not carbs

[Erik]

You and me both....

For me it is all about calories, not carbs

What do you weigh? You also train for endurance (ie. high expenditure and volume) Of course higher carbs is going to be better for you.

[Pandora]

What do you weigh? You also train for endurance (ie. high expenditure and volume) Of course higher carbs is going to be better for you.


I'm obviously not JackieLeigh, so I can only speak for me.. but I weigh 128 at 5'4" and I do not do endurance anything. Unless you count endurance as walking from the car to the house. :lol: However, I am very active as general rule. 1-2 hours of yoga per day, about 40m of walking per day at a minimum, and lifting several times a week... I also hike a lot, swim a good bit, etc.

However, for me, it just turned out that higher carbs helped me stabilize my blood sugars better... but I do have to be careful about what type of carbs I eat, obviously.

Then again, at about 1700-1900 calories per day and 50-60% of those calories from complex carbs, it's not all that crazy an amount... especially when you consider my PWO carbs into that.

[GraceGirl]

You and me both....

For me it is all about calories, not carbs


Well apparently, calories are insignificant when it comes to weight gain, according to Taubes, as long as they're good calories (or rather...NOT carbs). So as long as I live on a diet of gouda and sirloin, I'll never, ever, ever get fat!!

[jackieleigh]

What do you weigh? You also train for endurance (ie. high expenditure and volume) Of course higher carbs is going to be better for you.

I dont really know what I weight now. 105 maybe? I am in the same size clothes as I was at a lower weight.
Why does weight matter?

And yes, higher carbs is better for someone training for endurance but before I was training for the marathon I was also eating more carbs. I tried the LC thing and felt like crap, even towards the end of working with you I was wearing thin.

I think some people can just tolerate them more, I am lucky to be one of them

[Espi]

Feeling like giving this my best effort.


1. Dietary fat, whether saturated or not, does not cause heart disease.

Correct: wholeheartedly endorse this.


2. Carbohydrates do, because of their effect on the hormone insulin. The more easily-digestible and refined the carbohydrates and the more fructose they contain, the greater the effect on our health, weight, and well-being.

Correct.


3. Sugars--sucrose (table sugar) and high fructose corn syrup specifically--are particularly harmful. The glucose in these sugars raises insulin levels; the fructose they contain overloads the liver.


ONLY when consumed in massive quantities. There's nothing wrong with smaller amounts of sucrose or fructose. Or indulging in them infrequently. Chronic overconsumption = very bad news indeed. There's no real reason to be using HFCS products, but also no reason to point at these as the singular cause of overeating. If anything , it's overdrinking calories as liquid food doesn't get registrated as much. In that sense people who drink gallons of milk will get fatter more easily too.



4. Refined carbohydrates, starches, and sugars are also the most likely dietary causes of cancer, Alzheimer's Disease, and the other common chronic diseases of modern times.


Most likely yes.



5. Obesity is a disorder of excess fat accumulation, not overeating and not sedentary behavior.


Excuse me? Fat accumulation is caused by excess calories. Though yes, indeed if he means that someone shouldn't be as 'fat' considering their moderate calorie intake. There's a lot of people who don't really eat as much, but whose metabolisms are just plain slow, also because of chronically high blood sugar levels..
But the way he phrases it is physically incorrect and impossible.




6. Consuming excess calories does not cause us to grow fatter any more than it causes a child to grow taller.


Here's where I start to think he's losing it.



7. Exercise does not make us lose excess fat; it makes us hungry.


Well, surprise.. it really does for many of us. But yes, alas some people get hit by the major munchies and hence undo all of their 'dieting by exercise' efforts. However, if you do have too high blood sugar levels: exercise is the best gift to yourself, along with lowering carb intake which will help regulate blood sugar levels!



8. We get fat because of an imbalance--a disequilibrium--in the hormonal regulation of fat tissue and fat metabolism. More fat is stored in the fat tissue than is mobilized and used for fuel. We become leaner when the hormonal regulation of the fat tissue reverses this imbalance.



Yes, true. But it helps immensely to start... exercising!



9. Insulin is the primary regulator of fat storage. When insulin levels are elevated, we stockpile calories as fat. When insulin levels fall, we release fat from our fat tissue and burn it for fuel.



True. Again, exercise makes you more insulin-sensitive! Going too low in carbs for too long can (if I recall correctly) even make you more insulin-resistant!


10. By stimulating insulin secretion, carbohydrates make us fat and ultimately cause obesity. By driving fat accumulation, carbohydrates also increase hunger and decrease the amount of energy we expend in metabolism and physical activity.

Decrease the amount of energy we spend on burning fats. More carbs during exercise = less fat burnt. However, if you don't overdo it, fat burning can be increased in the non-exercise hours.



11. The fewer carbohydrates we eat, the leaner we will be.


Nope. I'm leaner than ever but eat more carbs than I ate in the time I've been low-carbing. But true enough ... eating way less carbs than when I still wasn't low-carbing. So there's a delicate balance.

[Espi]

:bump:

[GraceGirl]

Great analysis!!

[Espi]

Thanks for the appreciation.

Read Anthony Colpo's analysis today and he was far less friendly :D
Almost (or equally) as abusive as Lyle. He is near 100% right though.. I'd missed some points.

Not sure on #4 anymore though.


I've not read the book yet, but did read Taubes' recent article in New Yorker Magazine.

Years ago, I used to have respect for Taubes' work, and even cited his Soft Science of Dietary Fat article in TGCC. Those days are long gone. I don't know what it is about this metabolic advantage BS, but it really sucks in a lot of gullible folks, and decorated credentials clearly offer no immunity whatsoever.

Kevino claims that "Taubes is a journalist who looked at just about every study every published on diet and weight". Taubes clearly is not familiar with the numerous metabolic ward studies showing no such thing as a superior weight loss effect of low-carb diets at isocaloric intakes. He gets sucked in by the illusion of greater weight loss at isocaloric intakes in some, BUT NOT NEARLY ALL, free-living studies, in which the self-reported dietary intakes are notoriously prone to misreporting.

IF Taubes' message is that the current obesity epidemic is not due to insufficient activity and/or excessive calories, but simply due to high carbohydrate consumption, then his message is complete bullsh*t.

USDA food intake data shows that the average per capita intake of carbohydrates in 1909 was 501 grams; in 2000, it was 493 grams. To the best of my knowledge, there was no obesity "epidemic" in 1909...

Average caloric intake in 1909 = 3500. Average caloric intake in 2000 = 3900.

These figures were derived from food availability data and can be accessed here:
http://www.cnpp.usda.gov/publications/foodsupply/FoodSupply1909-2000.pdf

Average person in 1909 worked in manual labor. Average person in 2000 spends most of his/her day seated, with occasional breaks to shuffle his/her fat ass over to the food vending machine.

For crying out loud, this isn't exactly rocket science. Unfortunately, the plain truth just doesn't excite major publishers...

Bottom line is that Taubes is off sniffing on the wrong trail. Those who follow him can expect the same disappointing results that awaited those who believed Atkins' metabolic advantage rubbish and thus never bothered to create an energy deficit...

[GraceGirl]

Thanks for the appreciation.

Read Anthony Colpo's analysis today and he was far less friendly :D
Almost (or equally) as abusive as Lyle. He is near 100% right though.. I'd missed some points.

Not sure on #4 anymore though.


This is great! My arguments were with the same points. Saying that obesity is not caused by inactivity and high caloric intake is going too far. Calories are calories, and even if I eat 5000 calories a day from chicken and vegetables, and sit on my lazy rear watching all 19 episodes of My So-Called Life, I'm still going to get fat. (But that'd be a HECK of a lot of chicken and vegetables!)

[Espi]

And most people would start puking after 2000-3000 kcal of chicken.

There's 3 things though that require some thought

- some people indeed get so hungry from being active that it negates all their caloric loss. There's been a fairly recent study on this. And I guess Lyle even commented on it in his news letter. But is that an excuse to not exercise? I'd think not. Just make smarter choices. Like don't do exercise that makes you shiver (ice skating, skiing, swimming) as these are the activities that most likely will make you overeat. They once did a great study on people that were allowed to eat ad libitum and could do 3 sports: swimming, cycling, running. Swimmers nearly all GAINED weight.. runners & cyclists lost weight (cyclist lost most I think).

2 There is a metabolic advantage for people with severe insulin resistance.. but these same people would improve their sensitivity greatly with .... exercise and then they might eat a bit more carbs.

3 funky stuff happening when you're having food intolerances/allergies as this can affect metabolism by influences on thyroid.
This is what I've experienced. And sofar it indeed seems that eating highish amount of carbs but confine them to fruit and tuberous/bulby starches (pumpkin, carrot, potato, cassave) ,does indeed not make too much of a difference re wt loss, while wt loss would slow when eating the 'wrong' carbs (grains, legumes, etc.).

I'm sipping from a pineapple -banana smoothie right now :)
Trying to find out whether banana is on the 'wrong' food list..and then off to bed.

[Espi]

Thought it'd fit in here best of all.. just listening to the lecture by Gary Taubes in Berkeley: fascinating stuff!

He talks about how obesity is a poverty malnourishent problem and also talks about body dyslipidemia (very obese UB/lean LB and vice versa). I've not gone further than the first hour yet.. takes a long time when you try to get stuff done.

Good calories, bad calories (http://webcast.berkeley.edu/event_details.php?webcastid=21216)