Training with prepping for PT test (endurance based)

Discussion in 'Training' started by fluteangel, Oct 19, 2009.

  1. fluteangel

    fluteangel Well-Known Member

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    I'm dieting currently, and would like to continue doing so, but without over taxing my body.

    I want to do a 4 day split, while prepping to re-take my Army PT test in 3 weeks.

    I'd like to do this training:
    Day 1 - Upper body
    bench press - 4×4
    1-arm DB row - 3×8
    High cable rear delt flyes - 2×12

    Day 2 - Lower body
    Squat - 4×4
    1-leg RDL - 3×8
    Back extensions - 2×12

    Day 3 - Upper bod
    chin up - 4×4
    DB shoulder press - 3×8
    Rope Face pulls - 2×12

    Day 4 - Lower body
    Deadlift - 4×4
    Split Squat - 3×8
    Glute bridge with stability ball hamstring curl - 2×12


    I want to continue to lift heavy so I don't lose muscle mass in a deficit, which, if I just do the PT improvement plan below, which is focused mainly on endurance, I will. I could bring my calories up a little bit so I'm not so much in a deficit (12xbw instead of 11xbw).

    I have two possible PT imprvement plans.
    One is a 30-day plan
    the other is more intense, it's a 15-day shape up, to get ready in a hurry, I think.

    If I finished out following the 30 day plan, it looks very much like the first week Monday -Thursday, just repeated through the rest of the 3 weeks, however, what I did was merge the two. What would be my smarter option?

    P.S. I can tell you right now I won't be running 2-5 miles. It's hard enough for me to run 1 right now. I think the second option is too intense.

    Imrovement plan one looks like this:
    Monday: Pushup improvement plan #1, 8 minute abs
    Tuesday:Running long distance 8 minute abs
    Wednesday: Pushup interval training, uneven pushups, pushup pulses, full situps
    Thursday:running interval training/ 8 minute abs
    Friday: Pushup interval training, 8 minute abs
    Sat/Sunday: rest/light stretching

    Repeat for 3 weeks till Fridays and do a practice PT test.


    Here's the PT improvement plan that's meshed together:
    By the way, I want to mention that I did NOT make up the above plan. I got it from the Army.

    What do you think is my best option?

    To simplify things:

    I want to continue my fat loss, eating in a deficit, but since I have to work on endurance a bit with the PT test, I want to continue heavy lifting to keep my muscle.
    1) Should I do the easier, less intense PT improvement with lifting
    2) Should I do the more intense PT improvement with lifting
    3) Should I just ignore the PT improvement and throw in some extra pushups and situps on my lifting days and just concentrate on running?
    4) Should I bother to up my cals?
     
  2. sunshinekisses

    sunshinekisses Member

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    For simplicity, if I were you I would,

    1) continue with a deficit of 12xBW due to the amount of endurance activity involved in the PT training. You don't want to go too low with your calories, unless you are good at implementing refeeds properly.

    2) Lift heavy full body twice a week. You really don't need as much as you have listed there to maintain your mass. A couple times a week would be sufficient. And you'd want a lower training volume while dieting. So something like
    Squats/Leg Press: 3x6
    Bench Press/Incline Press: 3x6
    Row/Lat pull: 3x6
    Lateral Raises: 2x8
    Biceps: 2x8
    Triceps: 2x8
    Abs: 2x8
    Lower Back: 2x8

    ** / = or. don't do both exercises in one workout.

    3) If the PT improvement plan is something the army recommended, I would follow it - unless of course you have the skill to develop your own improvement plan that will yield the same results as their program will.
     
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  3. Sohee

    Sohee working on the bikini body

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    I only skimmed this and my head is hurting already.
    Why don't you go back and sift through your previous training plans you've had and pick out one that would best suit this new accommodation? Then tweak it to account for the pushups, running, etc.
    Let's keep it simple.
     
  4. Amy

    Amy Just say no to CANDY!!!

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    I'm not sure if the Army's PT test is like the Navy's but it seems to be fairly easy (especially given that you train currently) to receive an 'Excellent' on the PT. I know people who don't train for it, but just run like its the last time they will ever run :lol: and end up getting an excellent. :shrug:

    I think you are over complicating it. Just my opinion.
     
  5. fluteangel

    fluteangel Well-Known Member

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    Amy,
    I think the Navy's is similar, though they do LESS than the Army (only the Marines do more, I think), but that's ok. It's not that I can't pass, I've never had a problem before, my problem is that I try to do several things at once and want to get things right on the first go-round.

    Sunshine - thanks for the input, greatly appreciated! :buddies:


    After thinking about it all, I'm going to do the K.I.S.S. 4-day program I had put out before, it's got me lifting heavy with really low volume and that way, I'm in and out of the gym quickly (I'd rather do half-body training, than whole body right now, and split up my training). I'm going to fore-go the structured PT improvement plan I laid out before; I think it's far too intense and too much volume for me with where I am right now.

    So I'll get in pushups just about every day (a few here and a few there, when I think about it), with structured improvement drills maybe 3x's a week, same with abs. My focus is more on improving my running anyway. I figure if I get in a little bit of running every day, and then intersperse that with a couple days of running intervals and 2 days of longer runs, with 1-2 days of cross training, like cycling (all for no more than 30 minutes)

    That's how I got better at basic - do what you suck at, which was all three. But by the end, I didn't suck at anything.

    And if I start to feel run-down AT ALL, the calories are going to go up to 12xbw. I want fat loss, but not at the expense of injury to myself.


    Oh, and I found out that my leg pain was due to a strained gastroc. Not good since running makes it worse, and rest makes it heal. But what can I do besides stretching it a lot and foam rolling? I HAVE to take this stupid running test in 3 weeks, and if I don't work back up to running (2 miles isn't that hard) I'll have a repeat of last time.
     
  6. Sohee

    Sohee working on the bikini body

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    I really don't think it's necessary to do push ups everyday. You should give your muscles time to rest.
    Also, you need not worry about "endurance" training, given that 2 miles does not qualify as long distance. If you are, say, a triathlete, and are doing up to 2+ hours of endurance cardio a day, then that is a different story. You make it sound like you are prepping to run 10 miles :lol:
     
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  7. Amy

    Amy Just say no to CANDY!!!

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    Exaaaaactly. :thumb:

    I hate to say it, but most military members I know train for the PFT a couple days before. IF THAT :lol3:

    Even my husband has just showed up and finished with an 'excellent'. :hehe:
    Its not like you are out of shape and haven't trained in months right?
     
  8. Amy

    Amy Just say no to CANDY!!!

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    Not trying to beat this to death, but....

    Found this post last year from when you asked some questions regarding your PT test. I think this reply gives you your answer.

     
  9. clc315

    clc315 Active Member

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    You're overthinking this to the nth degree. Same thing happening on another forum. Focus on your number one priority and go with that. Forget the fatloss..it's only going to be three weeks. Get yourself prepped for the PT test and get injury free. Lift once or twice a week and hammer your PT stuff. Get aggressive with foam rolling, stretching and massage. Back off the last 3 days or so before the PT test to allow for recovery and regeneration. The fatloss phase can wait. K.I.S.S.
     
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  10. Sohee

    Sohee working on the bikini body

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    Angela, I don't think it's okay to ignore some people's responses and selectively reply to others. We've all pitched in to give you advice, most of the time knowing full well that there is a good chance that you won't take our advice anyway.

    I'm pointing this out because you've done this to me maybe half a dozen times already, as well as to others. And why do I still offer advice? I don't know, maybe because I want to help you out and cross my fingers that for once you will not be rude.
     
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  11. Sohee

    Sohee working on the bikini body

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    Hello
    Hello
    Hello
    Hello
     
  12. MichelleS

    MichelleS Well-Known Member

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  13. fluteangel

    fluteangel Well-Known Member

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    I am sorry if I came across as rude, that's truly not my intention. I know there are a ton of people out there smarter than me with a lot more wisdom and experience and knowledge, and being the nerd that I am, I really just enjoy seeing thins from as many different angles as possible. I don't mean it to come across like I'm ignoring people.:oops:

    What I don't understand is why a few people want me to stop with the fat loss? How will losing fat (especially with my rate being as slow as it is) affect my ability to do pushups/situps and running? I thought it might even help.

    I'm sick to death of focusing my efforts around this PT test and fatloss. But the truth is, I failed it once so I HAVE to do it again, and I'm sick of the fat loss thing taking so long, it's been since January, but it's also been a journey of discovery, having to find out about my thyroid and how to make that work with fat loss and training. So I want it to be DONE.:cena:

    So, this is what I'm doing:
    I'm diong the K.I.S.S. plan - which I outlined above - it's VERY low volume, and I'm keeping my cals where they are for now, implementing refeeds once a week. With the pushups and situps, I'm just doing them on days that I lift and not worrying about the rest of it, cuz I passed it. With the running, I'm doing running intervals 1-2 times a week (depending on how I feel) and doing other SS cardio for 20-30 minutes, because my cardio system has gone down and it can't keep up with my legs at the moment. :)

    So I'm conditioning my lungs bit by bit and getting back into running because while Mols could run 1.5 miles without stopping, I am still having trouble running 1 mile without stopping. So I also need to work on that part of endurance. I'm definitely willing to try some things that people suggest, but I also know that what works for one person doesn't always work for another. I can't run all year and then run two miles 3 times and take the test. I can't run that far without stopping or slowing down. Some members can show up without training and pass, I want to do better than that :dumbbells:, but I don't see why those three little things should sidetrack my other goals, you know?

    I've been foam rolling every day for the last few months, and stretching, drinking lots of water and I'm not agressively dieting, AND I found out my leg problem is due to a strained gastrocnemius. I'm in the process of getting a script from the doc to see a physical therapist to help me out. I'm foam rolling it in the meantime.

    I realize I have the tendency to be a perfectionist when it comes to making decisions, which is silly, and at least I realize that, so please don't think I'm ignoring you. I really do appreciate all your advice and help. Knowing I can do that many pushups and situps is great (though they could certainly use improvement), but I also know my running is a problem - I don't think it has to hinder my weight lifting though. I haven't lost any weight in a week (and measurements haven't changed) and I"ve kept my cals fairly consistant, but my activity has actually been pretty low, so I think this extra activity can only help me. I've done cardio twice and intervals once, and this has just been in the last week.

    Haha, so basically, what I've outlined that I'm doing is lifting lower volume with cardio, still less than what some of you do, I'm sure, how is that detrimental?
     
  14. Sohee

    Sohee working on the bikini body

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    But... you are.

    You are trying to do too many things at once, and that doesn't work well for you. At all. I think for YOU, it is best to focus on ONE thing at a time so you can narrow down your 23481 options you always manage to create. Simply choose something and stick with it, instead of asking us if you should eat 39.5g of fat or 41.3 of fat. Because really? It doesn't make a huge difference.

    Shouldn't you, as a self-professed fitness professional, use your own personal trainer expertise to figure this out? I find it ironic that you yourself admit that others here on the board know more than you, and you even come here asking about your own clients' plans. What if they came on here and saw your posts? What would they think?

    So? This PT test is going to be done in a few weeks. You can maintain your weight just for the sake of simplicity, then resume the diet again once you're done. Or not even worry about how much food you're eating and eat intuitively-- maybe in that case the weight will fall off on its own. Why do you feel like you have to get everything done at once? Prioritize.

    It doesn't seem very simple to me :lol:

    Again, you're trying too hard to stuff it all in.

    But you have! And you are! Who said running is going to hinder your weight lifting? No one did. And it won't, provided that you aren't running yourself into the ground. I run most days just because I love it, and I've kept my numbers up in the gym.

    It feels like you are just figuring out what all the options are, not even considering which might be better than the other, and asking us to do the work for you. Am I in the ballpark here? You throw together random stuff and hand them to us. And then expect us to hand it back to you, neat and organized. Actually yes, that is what you do, at least some of the time-- you already admitted to it on another board.

    Look again closely at the pushup plan you've posted. And then read it again. Does that not look detrimental to your own sanity?
     
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  15. Redone

    Redone Member

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    wow.... 100% behind Sohee

    fluteangel - no one is AGAINST you. Don't take the responses to your requests for advice into attempts to thwart your progress, because they aren't. It is simply advice.

    From those who you say know more than you do.

    And they are all in agreement.

    Only they aren't exactly what you wanted to hear.
     
  16. fluteangel

    fluteangel Well-Known Member

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    Sohee, I respect your opinion, and I respect everyone else's opinion. However, ignoring what people say and choosing not to respond to it, or even choosing not to do it are different things. I have listened to what everyone said and I"m grateful for the information they've graciously provided and then made a decision. Are you mad at me because I didn't do what you said?

    If what I say upsets you, you have the choice on how you want to respond, or not.:dry:

    For the record, I took the K.I.S.S. program as a suggestion from someone else on another board. I think you're confusing this plan with another. It's a program written by Patrick Ward, basically a 3-day split made into a 4-day:

    Day 1 - Upper body
    bench press - 4×4
    1-arm DB row - 3×8
    High cable rear delt flyes - 2×12

    Day 2 - Lower body
    Squat - 4×4
    1-leg RDL - 3×8
    Back extensions - 2×12

    Day 3 - Upper body
    chin up - 4×4
    DB shoulder press - 3×8
    Rope Face pulls - 2×12

    Day 4 - Lower body
    Deadlift - 4×4
    Split Squat - 3×8
    SHELCS - 2×12


    I'm simply adding in pushups, situps and more cardio to that plan. More cardio as in I haven't really done much of anything in the last several weeks, so anything I do at this point cardio-wise is more than what I have been doing.


    Yes, it does look detrimental which is why I'm not doing it. So forget I ever said it.

    I did maintain for the first PT test, I don't feel like doing it again. I'm not working in a huge deficit here, so I don't see why it matters.

    As for posting different plans, look, I was asked several times "why don't you post your idea and we'll give you feedback"? So I did. I actually did some thinking about what I put together, but apparently I got overloaded with options. I'm human, not perfect, so that silly plan is what I came up with. It almost always seems easier to make up a plan for someone else, because it's not you that you are dealing with. I've come to the realization that 1) I overthink things and I'm aware of it - I'm working on ignoring that part of me and doing what I know 2) I KNOW how to keep things simple 3) I don't keep things simple when it comes to myself. Why? I don't know. It's the way God made me. My brother, too. We all have flaws, and this is mine, please stop bashing me about it - I"M AWARE OF IT. :) Does this sound better "Hi, my name is Angela and I'm an overthinker/overanalyzer" :lol:

    I've made a plan I'm sticking with and I thank you all for your help and suggestions, I DID listen to them, I'm just not on this board every day to read them. I apologize for my delay in posting.

    Sohee, what do you want from me?
     
  17. MichelleS

    MichelleS Well-Known Member

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    Yes I agree 100% with Sohee. And you do seem to make those that answer your question feel like you're not even reading what they put time in to explaining. I feel like most of us here really want to help but then you ask the same questions and we answer them 100 times that why should we even bother with answering them again and again and again.... You say you want to learn but I feel that's just me that if the response to your problem or question was not answered by the "guru":lub:/ owner of the board you're on that all others simple don't know there stuff.

    I've taken the NSCA test I just failed to send in my CPR card in time to get my paper cert. So I may not have 'letters' after my name but that doesn't mean what I or anyone else may say is not good info. Ive reading all... Okay maybe not all but most the journals that come to my house every month. I chose to not train clients cause I feared I really didn't know ENOUGH to make it my job just yet so I continue to learn more :)

    No problem with you asking questions to learn more but I think when you ask the same questions over and over its not that you want to learn its that you want others to do the work for you and hand you a plan so you can just do the execution of the plan.


    Okay now stepping down and putting my BB away before I get in trouble
     
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  18. Erik

    Erik Admin

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    You better not have just called me a guru or I will :ecw: you into next week. :lol:

    You posted all that from your bb? :lol:
     
  19. smuggie

    smuggie Maureen aka Mo

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  20. MichelleS

    MichelleS Well-Known Member

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    :cardio: nooooooooo I did not call you a guru!


    LMAO! Okay so maybe I did :p


    It took me a while but yes I did since I've got so much time to kill up here at work with nothing to do :lol:
     

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